CoG Centre of Gravity

  • Klipkopwildlife
  • Klipkopwildlife's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • I'm supposed to be retired!
More
02 Nov 2011 11:39 #1 by Klipkopwildlife
CoG Centre of Gravity was created by Klipkopwildlife
If an aircraft is going to fly successfully the CoG must be in the right place. Too far back and the plane will never fly again!:( Too far forward and it may.
On a parallel wing (width the same all the way along) the CoG shouls be 25 to 33% of the width back from the front edge. 30% is good for Leccy's. 33% for Ic's since putting fuel in will always bring it forward.
Do not be tempted to go further back that 33%, it's unlikely you'll ever fly that model again.:sick:

Do it now, you may never get another chance

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
06 Nov 2011 21:59 #2 by The Beard
Replied by The Beard on topic Re: CoG Centre of Gravity
It intrigues me when people talk of moving the C of G I assume it is referring to adding weight to balance the model.The formula for adding weight to the front or back differs immensley because of the distance to the rear of the model from the C of G is much further to the rear.I believe 200 grams at the front can be the equivelant of 20 grams at the rear.I did read where one guy added 300 grams to the rear,the model crashed.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
06 Nov 2011 22:06 #3 by Phil Wood
Replied by Phil Wood on topic Re: CoG Centre of Gravity
It's the same principle as a lever Stephen .... given a long enough lever you could lift the Earth. :cheer:
Model balancing is like using a lever. If you have a lever with a pivot point (COG) and 6 inches to the model nose..... 24 inches to the tail,.... 4 grams at the nose could be counteracted by 1 gram at the tail.

Pol. ( 6 inches is 1/4 of 24 inches)

I just own the forum .... you guys make it great thanks.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Klipkopwildlife
  • Klipkopwildlife's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • I'm supposed to be retired!
More
07 Nov 2011 12:50 #4 by Klipkopwildlife
Replied by Klipkopwildlife on topic Re: CoG Centre of Gravity
With ARtFs' and Tupperware you don't have much leaway with placing equipment, so it's easy to see that you might have to add weight in order to correct it, however err on the side of forward, then you won't have to add so much weight to the tail, (them levers again)

With a Radio Queen I made up two supports, then marked the CoG on the fuselage, from there I could play nicely with the equipment to get the CoG right, no extra weight for me!B)

Do it now, you may never get another chance
Attachments:

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Klipkopwildlife
  • Klipkopwildlife's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • I'm supposed to be retired!
More
07 Nov 2011 12:53 #5 by Klipkopwildlife
Replied by Klipkopwildlife on topic Re: CoG Centre of Gravity
Note the Tank position, I'm hoping this model will have a duration of about 5 hours (2.5pint tank + petrol conversion) It's right on the CoG so there'll be no CoG change during the flight.

Do it now, you may never get another chance

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
08 Nov 2011 07:10 #6 by The Beard
Replied by The Beard on topic Re: CoG Centre of Gravity
Looking forward to the Radio Queen build

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
23 Feb 2012 05:15 - 01 Sep 2019 12:16 #7 by Eric
Replied by Eric on topic How to find the centre of gravity
NOTE This method is not accurate! It gives you a good safe point to start from, ie slightly nose heavy MOST OF THE TIME!!!




The first one is easy, a parallel chord wing, merely take one third of the chord, and that is your safe start point.
Another way is to assume the spars are at one third chord, and take that as the c of g.

The second one a swept leading edge/straight trailing edge.
Take one third of the root chord, and mark it. Then find one third of BOTH tip chords, and put a straight-edge across. Mark on the ROOT chord where the lines cross.
Then take 50% of the difference between the two marks, and go forward a bit, and that is your start point.

The third one is a straight leading edge, forward swept trailing edge.
Do just the same as before, but note that the difference range is smaller, therefore more critical.

The fourth one, swept leading AND trailing edges.
Exactly like before, the one thirds rule.

For a biplane, do exactly the same for the appropriate planform - FOR EACH WING, then split the difference between top and bottom wing start points.

This SHOULD work for a Delta planform as well, but there are too many variables, ie wing sweep, tip chord, span, etc, to accommodate all options.

As I put at the beginning - this usually gives a safe START POINT for finding the c of g by flying the model.

if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
Attachments:
Last edit: 01 Sep 2019 12:16 by Klipkopwildlife.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Dave Underhill
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
09 Oct 2012 17:12 #8 by Dave Underhill
Replied by Dave Underhill on topic Re: CoG Centre of Gravity
Afternoon, I wonder if you could help? I have just rebuilt an old Radio Queen (I think pre Buckle), I'm not sure why as it would have been quicker to build from scratch but there. Can you help with setup - G of G and control throws would be useful.

BR

Dave U

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Garry Pollard
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
09 Oct 2012 17:25 #9 by Garry Pollard
Replied by Garry Pollard on topic Re: CoG Centre of Gravity
Hi dave and wecome to this forum.
As far as the radio queen is concerned, I had one more years ago than I care to remember. However as it is a constant chord wing I feel that it would be safe to say 1/3 back from the leading edge would be a safe place to start. Mine if I remember was not very responsive to rudder, so put a fair amount in and if poss put in high and low rates and then you could switch as required

Garry

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Klipkopwildlife
  • Klipkopwildlife's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • I'm supposed to be retired!
More
09 Oct 2012 18:14 #10 by Klipkopwildlife
Replied by Klipkopwildlife on topic Re: CoG Centre of Gravity
Hi Dave, mine hasn't flown yet (pressure) but the plan shows 120mm back from the leading edge for the CoG. There is provision for about 18o of travel for the Rudder and elevator which will be more than enough for a model of this type.

Do it now, you may never get another chance

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Dave Underhill
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
09 Oct 2012 20:17 #11 by Dave Underhill
Replied by Dave Underhill on topic Re: CoG Centre of Gravity
Good man - thanks

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Klipkopwildlife
  • Klipkopwildlife's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • I'm supposed to be retired!
More
29 Aug 2019 13:33 #12 by Klipkopwildlife
Replied by Klipkopwildlife on topic CoG Centre of Gravity
The CoG on an aircraft is so important, the CoG MUST be forward of the centre of pressure (the lift centre created by the main wing). Depending of the foil section this CoP can actually move backwards and forwards with speed. Using you fingers at the wing tips to see where it balances is in my opinion, not good enough! The are a number of balance checkers on the market but it's easy to make one for a few pence that's just as good. You just need two short pieces of plank say, 1' x 3" (300 x 75mm) and two old style pencils with the eraser (can't call them rubbers any more) in the end. Drill a hole in the centre of each plank that's just big enough (interference fit would be nice) to push the point of the pencil in. Cut the eraser to a chisel point, 90o will do it, and not too sharp. Push and glue each pencil into each plank with the length of the point across the planks. When you want to check a CoG, place the planks a suitable distance apart, place your planes recommended CoG point on the erasers, if it's nose down move weight rearwards, if it's tail down move weight forwards until she's straight and level. Treat the manuals recommendations with a pinch of salt, I've seen too many errors in print. Take the wing chord measurement, multiply by 0.28 and aim for the CoG to be that far back from the leading edge. If you're close to that figure, your plane will always be flyable, you can fiddle with the final point later.

Do it now, you may never get another chance
Thanks: crash happy

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
29 Aug 2019 17:44 #13 by Quorneng
Replied by Quorneng on topic CoG Centre of Gravity
This is an old (2012) thread but interesting and very true non the less.
If the wing has any sweep back determining a 'working' CofG position does get a bit more complex.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
29 Aug 2019 17:46 #14 by Eric
Replied by Eric on topic CoG Centre of Gravity
That works with a 'plank' wing, but not for a tapered or swept one.
I've got a drawing I did ages ago, showing and describing how to find the 'best start' (or ball-park) balance point.
When I find it again, I'll put it on, or I'll re-draw it.

if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
Thanks: paul d

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
01 Sep 2019 17:41 - 01 Sep 2019 17:49 #15 by Eric
Replied by Eric on topic CoG Centre of Gravity
Ha! After hunting through all my files and hard-drives, I found it - on here, about eight posts and four years back!
[badass]
Anyway - as I have re-drawn it, here it is again!


NOTE - this gives you a good START-POINT, not the best or final C of G position!
Remember the golden rule - an AFT c of g flies once - - it's a crash waiting to happen
A forward c of g flies safely - the elevators may be soggy, but it won't flick on you.

if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
Attachments:
Last edit: 01 Sep 2019 17:49 by Eric. Reason: added a comment
Thanks: Klipkopwildlife, THE BLACKBIRD

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Time to create page: 0.339 seconds