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2 metre wingspan autopilot plane batteries/motors
- morgan
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I will be flying using 2500mah li-ion cells (best i could find for mAH but if you know of better ones that i can get in the UK pls tell me) which are linked below. I will wire them in series to create 2S batteries and i found that the Emax CF2822 motor could work for this, but I don't know much about RC motors and whether using this motor with 2S li-ion cells would work. Emax says that it can run on 2S or 3S, but i will be using Li-Ion batteries and i want this motor to be used to fly a ~500g powered glider for around 20 minutes. Will this actually work? If not do you know of any motors or batteries which would work better for this?
www.nubattery.co.uk/samsung-25r-18650-battery
emaxmodel.com/collections/bl-cf-series-m...airplane-multicopter
Thanks so much
- Morgan
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- Klipkopwildlife
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- I'm supposed to be retired!
Do it now, you may never get another chance
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- Eric
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First question, Morgan - have you ever flown an r/c model plane of any sort?
Second question - what model were you intending to use?
Third question - Are you familiar with the UK law regarding model flight - staying within line of sight, not above 400 feet above ground level, not overflying people or buildings etc?
2 metres is not very big, but it is the wing AREA that is more important, more area means it can carry more weight more slowly.
Now, that little motor you show is for small quadcopters, not gliders. For a glider, you want a slower-revving one with a larger diameter and pitch folding prop, hich is more efficient..
Now a battery delivers DC vollts, but a brushless motor requires AC volts 3 phase. So you have to put a speed controller between the battery and motor.
The speed controller will not work on it's own, you need a radio-control reciever to tell it to work.That means - in turn - that you need a matching transmitter to work it!
Now you said you want to use lithium Ion batteries - fair enough, but they have a lower voltage output than a lithium polymer set - and you need a special charger for either of them. You can't use a 12v car battery charger or a science lab 12v supply - or you'd have a bonfire on your hands!
You also claim that the model will weigh around 500gms or1.1 lb - . That will be a very flimsy model that won't survive much of a knock.
Autopilot? Youll be lucky! You can get self stabilizing electronics, but they are not altitude or course holdng things, they just try to keep the wings level. Every little bump in the air as the model flies will alter the direction it is going in, so that means you have to have full r/c and some way of chasing it, to keep it in sight!
I've just weighed a pair of 18650 li-ion batteries, and they weigh 92 grams., without any wiring or anything!
if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
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- THE BLACKBIRD
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- Quorneng
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The take off and landing are relatively high risk operations compared to flying so there is advantage in reducing the number you have to do which suggest maximising the plane's duration.
Do you have to use Li-Ion batteries? LiPo batteries are commonly used in planes. The a bit lighter of their capacity and are available in a wides range of sizes.
The motor you have identified is adequate for a 500g plane but is likely a bit more powerful and thus heavier than you really need to just fly.
Are you using a specific ready made plane or is it a design and build exercise?
Sorry for all the questions but some details would make it easier to advise..
Just as a tease this plane was built for endurance rather than distance. It uses a 3800 mAh 2s LiPo and with that can fly for well over 3 hours non stop covering close to 50k through the air.
It weighs 436g with the battery. It uses a smaller 24g motor than the 40g CF2822.
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- morgan
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I have flown a lot of RC planes over the last 5 years, I designed my own plane on fusion 360, i am familiar with UK regulations for RC planes.
wing area is 4,400 cm squared.
I found an ESC already, Hobbywing Skywalker 2-3S 20A Brushless ESC With 5V/2A BEC For RC Airplane Models from bangood.
I have the FS-I6X and FS-IA6/10B which i can connect to a mini pix flight controller, i also have a charger that works for li-ion and li-po batteries, so that shouldn't be an issue.
To be perfectly honest I haven't built a powered glider before, i stuck to park fliers/warbirds, I've heard that it is better to have a ~600Kv motor but i haven't been able to find a good one yet, so if you know of any good ones that I can get in the UK then please tell me.
The Emax website recommends a 10x4.7 slow flier prop on the website so I had assumed that it would be ok.
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- morgan
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I was going to use LI-Ion because they seem to generally seem to have higher mAH than Li-Pos and a lower output, since the model shouldn't need high power to fly as a glider, i assumed this would make it such that i don't need to land as often. I designed my own aircraft in fusion 360, it has a Naca 6412 airfoil with 1 degree of dihedral from the fuselage.
In terms of the flight distance we plan to use an autopilot but follow along in a vehicle, similarly to what RCtestflight did with the 100km solar flight, except we will have to land at times.
I think using a bigger motor would be better just because of the scale of the model.
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- Eric
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As you intend to chase the model from a car. I suspect that you are going to get snarled up in traffic an awful lot. You might also find that the metal of the car roof will screen the radio signals. Do you know what a Faraday Cage is? Or do you have a rag-top 'sports' car you can take the top off, so you can see the model while it is overhead?
Do you have any idea just how fast your model will fly? I have a powered glider that cruises at 80 mph, and can easily top 100 in a shallow dive.Your chase car will have to go twice as fast, to keep up, or you will waste a lot of battery - circling - while you catch up.
Are there any tall trees, tall buildngs, or tunnels on your proposed route?
Try a little experiment - fly a model you know inside out, then at a safe height, turn your back on it for ten seconds. How long did it take you to reacquire visual contact, and was it where you expected it to be?
I haven't used the flysky radio, so I can't comment on that. I use Taranis and Futaba.
600kv motor, you'll be lucky. The kv number tells you how many rpm's the motor will give for each volt of the power supply/ A 600 will be referred to as a thumper - intended for very large scale models - and will swing a circa 20" diameter prop!. All my motor running on 3S are around 1500 kv.
HobbyKing, in China - USED to have a wide range of motors, and you could look them up on a chart, to find the one you want. I put USED because the business recently changed hands and the website isn't sorted out yet.
if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
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- morgan
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Also, i would very much like to know how you got a "powered glider" to cruise at 80mph, because that is crazy fast, faster than most cars can legally go in the UK. I have a 4S F-18 than doesn't even go that fast at max power.
Our plane will be going about 20kmh.
I am not the person in charge of mapping for our team, so can't detail the route, but he will be ensuring that we don't go through tunnels or near buildings.
I am not going to do that test because I want to keep my plane.
I will definitely look at that chart, however, because that sounds great.
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- Eric
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if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
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- THE BLACKBIRD
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- Quorneng
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I fear your proposed autopilot flight will be bumping into quite a few UAV (Unmanned Aerial Vehicle) limitations.
The principle of the CAA permission is that a hobby plane must be under the control of a pilot at all times. You are allowed gyro assistance but continuous autonomous control makes it a true UAV that is outside the hobby plane CAA permission. The penalties for braking the model plane flight rules can result in a substantial fine.
I trust the pilot will have "Operator" and "Pilot" authorisation either directly from the CAA or via the BMFA.
All model plane flying in the UK is done from a "location". Flying down what I presume will be public roads would be considered risking the good name of RC flying. It is questionable if the model plane third party insurance normally gained by BFMA membership would cover such a flight.
Sorry to be so negative but I feel obliged to point out the potential problems
Incidentally your CF2822 is certainly capable of driving a 10x4.7 prop on a 2s.
I use one driving a 9x6 three blade prop and on a 3s! As it draws just on 20A at full power it uses a 30A ESC.
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- Klipkopwildlife
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- morgan
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We will absolutely have flyer ID and Operator ID certification and would be flying down either public roads or cycle paths in rural East England, at a height of about 40 metres. The roads would be relatively empty and we will be avoiding all main roads by any means necessary. I am aware of the 50 metre limit set in the drone and model aircraft code, however, this rule is regularly broken when people fly in parks for example, Richmond flying field, which is a public flying field but also one where people regularly walk through.
We will of course not have our maiden flight be the 50km and so will ensure to do plenty of testing beforehand to ensure that the plane is very safe.
Is BMFA insurance required for RC flight?
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- Eric
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You say you are going to chase the craft on a bicycle towing a trailer. You'd need an olympic pedaller to maintain at least 40 kph over your distance! with three people, one pedaller who will be watching the road, one flyer on the trailer controlling the model, and one observer, in case the controller loses sight behind a tree, or something.
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The SUA (Small Unmanned Aircraft) document you refer to expired in December 2020, as far as I can see, and hasn't been replaced.
if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
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