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Colour Authentication
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01 Mar 2015 15:15 #1
by Ex-Member
Colour Authentication was created by Ex-Member
How does one authenticate the colour of a model?
The BMFA Scale Rules say:
"Correct colour may be established from colour photographs, from published descriptions, from samples of original paint, or from published colour drawings. For the F4 classes written descriptions must be accompanied by colour chips certified by a competent authority."
If you haven't got a colour photo etc, then the first prob is to find a description of the colour. That said, there is normally something somewhere that will give a hint - internet, libraries, museums, manufacturers, plastic models, etc. On the other hand, I have a monochrome pic of a Gotha 145 which just begs to be modelled, but I've been looking for some 25 years for an authentic description of the colouring...
Given the description, it's then just a case of getting adequate colour chips.
For military aircraft there are several outlets that provide pretty good colour swatches, but what about civil machines? My ABC Robin is described in a 1930 copy of flight as being orange and black, but what shade of orange? And who would know anyway? In the event, I discovered a colour painting of the aircraft on the cover of a 1947 AeroModeller and used that as authentication.
The next challenge is finding an acceptable 'competent authority' to sign off the colour chips that are derived from the written descriptions. Most of us in the Scale Modelling world make up a colour chip using the same paint as on the model and get it signed by a suitable person as authentic. Even then, the end result is only as good as the whim of the judges who are assessing the model. I once provided some of the original paint used to colour a full-size SE5A for a modelling colleague and the scale judges only gave him 5/10 for colour! On the other hand, I signed off colour chips for Pete McDermott's DH4 model for that year's world champs, but they still marked him down because he didn't include samples of the black and white used on the model in his colour chips.
In the end though, it's not a big deal as the colour only counts for 5% of the static marks and only 2.5% or the marks overall. However, it's nice to get the colour as close as possible to the original when building a scale model.
The BMFA Scale Rules say:
"Correct colour may be established from colour photographs, from published descriptions, from samples of original paint, or from published colour drawings. For the F4 classes written descriptions must be accompanied by colour chips certified by a competent authority."
If you haven't got a colour photo etc, then the first prob is to find a description of the colour. That said, there is normally something somewhere that will give a hint - internet, libraries, museums, manufacturers, plastic models, etc. On the other hand, I have a monochrome pic of a Gotha 145 which just begs to be modelled, but I've been looking for some 25 years for an authentic description of the colouring...
Given the description, it's then just a case of getting adequate colour chips.
For military aircraft there are several outlets that provide pretty good colour swatches, but what about civil machines? My ABC Robin is described in a 1930 copy of flight as being orange and black, but what shade of orange? And who would know anyway? In the event, I discovered a colour painting of the aircraft on the cover of a 1947 AeroModeller and used that as authentication.
The next challenge is finding an acceptable 'competent authority' to sign off the colour chips that are derived from the written descriptions. Most of us in the Scale Modelling world make up a colour chip using the same paint as on the model and get it signed by a suitable person as authentic. Even then, the end result is only as good as the whim of the judges who are assessing the model. I once provided some of the original paint used to colour a full-size SE5A for a modelling colleague and the scale judges only gave him 5/10 for colour! On the other hand, I signed off colour chips for Pete McDermott's DH4 model for that year's world champs, but they still marked him down because he didn't include samples of the black and white used on the model in his colour chips.
In the end though, it's not a big deal as the colour only counts for 5% of the static marks and only 2.5% or the marks overall. However, it's nice to get the colour as close as possible to the original when building a scale model.
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- Eric
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01 Mar 2015 16:13 #2
by Eric
if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
Replied by Eric on topic Colour Authentication
What is a paint chip, Andy?
To me, a paint chip is a piece of the original paint that has been broken off - but I don't think Old Warden, Duxford, etc would allow you to go in with a hammer, hitting the aircraft you want a sample of!
To me, a paint chip is a piece of the original paint that has been broken off - but I don't think Old Warden, Duxford, etc would allow you to go in with a hammer, hitting the aircraft you want a sample of!
if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
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01 Mar 2015 18:01 #3
by Ex-Member
Replied by Ex-Member on topic Colour Authentication
As far as the BMFA Scale Tech Committee is concerned, it's a piece of material, normally about 25mm square, with an example of the colour on it Eric.
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- Klipkopwildlife
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10 Mar 2015 07:59 #4
by Klipkopwildlife
Do it now, you may never get another chance
Replied by Klipkopwildlife on topic Colour Authentication
Thanks for that info Andy, at the risk of opening a can of worms, getting colours 'signed off' does seem to be be a bit dependant on who you know, not what you know!
I would have thought that there must be instrumentation available today that can analise a colour in a flash (squeeze of a trigger). Probably expensive but I would have thought very necessary at top levels of competition.
I would have thought that there must be instrumentation available today that can analise a colour in a flash (squeeze of a trigger). Probably expensive but I would have thought very necessary at top levels of competition.
Do it now, you may never get another chance
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10 Mar 2015 08:02 #5
by Ex-Member
Replied by Ex-Member on topic Colour Authentication
i personally think it is a bit OTT.
but if that is what it takes to compete at the top level good luck to them.
It's not for me.
but if that is what it takes to compete at the top level good luck to them.
It's not for me.
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10 Mar 2015 10:18 #6
by Eric
if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
Replied by Eric on topic Colour Authentication
So - you have to produce a chip of paint, or a snip of fabric with colour on it. How do you prove that it is from the aircraft you claim it is?
I know OW used to have a box by the viewer's gallery, with scrap bits of whatever aircraft was under renovation, for the public to remove - but is that the genuine original colour, someone's previous re-paint, new paint, old weathered sun-bleached paint - etc etc.
I know OW used to have a box by the viewer's gallery, with scrap bits of whatever aircraft was under renovation, for the public to remove - but is that the genuine original colour, someone's previous re-paint, new paint, old weathered sun-bleached paint - etc etc.
if you are calm and collected when all about you are going berserk - you've missed something important!
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- Klipkopwildlife
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10 Mar 2015 14:36 #7
by Klipkopwildlife
Do it now, you may never get another chance
Replied by Klipkopwildlife on topic Colour Authentication
Knowing how helpful many people can be, I imagine that if you asked one of the top bods to meet you somewhere (like Old Warden) they would be only too happy to help you. But you'd have to be 'knocking on the door' in terms of a '1000hr' build.Andy Sephton wrote: How does one authenticate the colour of a model?
The BMFA Scale Rules say:
"Correct colour may be established from colour photographs, from published descriptions, from samples of original paint, or from published colour drawings. For the F4 classes written descriptions must be accompanied by colour chips certified by a competent authority."
If you haven't got a colour photo etc, then the first prob is to find a description of the colour. That said, there is normally something somewhere that will give a hint - internet, libraries, museums, manufacturers, plastic models, etc. On the other hand, I have a monochrome pic of a Gotha 145 which just begs to be modelled, but I've been looking for some 25 years for an authentic description of the colouring...
Given the description, it's then just a case of getting adequate colour chips.
For military aircraft there are several outlets that provide pretty good colour swatches, but what about civil machines? My ABC Robin is described in a 1930 copy of flight as being orange and black, but what shade of orange? And who would know anyway? In the event, I discovered a colour painting of the aircraft on the cover of a 1947 AeroModeller and used that as authentication.
The next challenge is finding an acceptable 'competent authority' to sign off the colour chips that are derived from the written descriptions. Most of us in the Scale Modelling world make up a colour chip using the same paint as on the model and get it signed by a suitable person as authentic. Even then, the end result is only as good as the whim of the judges who are assessing the model. I once provided some of the original paint used to colour a full-size SE5A for a modelling colleague and the scale judges only gave him 5/10 for colour! On the other hand, I signed off colour chips for Pete McDermott's DH4 model for that year's world champs, but they still marked him down because he didn't include samples of the black and white used on the model in his colour chips.
In the end though, it's not a big deal as the colour only counts for 5% of the static marks and only 2.5% or the marks overall. However, it's nice to get the colour as close as possible to the original when building a scale model.
Do it now, you may never get another chance
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10 Mar 2015 21:05 #8
by Ex-Member
Replied by Ex-Member on topic Colour Authentication
Thanks for the interesting comments chaps. Bottom line, I suppose, is that it's horses for courses. If you want to compete at the top level, you need to study the rules and comply with them - either that or stick to sports flying...and there's certainly nothing wrong with that!
In answer to some of the more direct comments, for competition scale one picks a single full-size aircraft and models it. So if the colour on the full-size is weathered, damaged, repaired or even just wrong, it doesn't matter. All that matters is that it's replicated in model form.
In the event of difficulty in getting authentication of colour chips, help can be obtained by contacting the BMFA Scale Technical Committee - www.scalebmfa.co.uk
In answer to some of the more direct comments, for competition scale one picks a single full-size aircraft and models it. So if the colour on the full-size is weathered, damaged, repaired or even just wrong, it doesn't matter. All that matters is that it's replicated in model form.
In the event of difficulty in getting authentication of colour chips, help can be obtained by contacting the BMFA Scale Technical Committee - www.scalebmfa.co.uk
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
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